gp2 difficulty level beyond ace

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roland ratzenberger
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gp2 difficulty level beyond ace

Post by roland ratzenberger » 26.09.2017, 18:25

hello to all. i think that this question have been posted quite differently before . What i want to ask is that, how can we make the grand prix 2 even more difficult from the standard ace mode via gp2 ediotr. i know some values such as selected team power , random power variaton, the grip level the weight etc. i have also noticed that the grip can be varied bewteen race and quali..in addition what is random grip range and the grip factor.. i wish someon can help to simplify this words in my mind. i played grand prix 2 for almost 10 years, after a long and succesfull carreer in gp1 anf gp4 ( i downloaded this game in 2008 and from then i play it to death) and only recently i have manage to make the game more difficult by using the selected team power. But what i want to know is how i can combine this factors to make the game even more difficult , and what does this factors mean

THANKS IN ADVANCE FOR ALL THE HELPING ANSWERS I MAY RECIECE :D :D :D :D :D

ismael
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Re: gp2 difficulty level beyond ace

Post by ismael » 26.09.2017, 23:24

Great! I'll try to go straight to the point. You could open GP2Edit and import or load the carset of the original game, as the best example.
I hope that if Rremedio or some other expert sees something wrong here, they can correct me. I've learned from them.


What I change is:
Selected Team Power (always selected, otherwise it's like playing the original game)
Grip (Race and Qualification) - This is the maximum performance each driver can achieve. (Actually, this is like driver+chassis, but let's keep it simple).
Random Grip Range - This is how much the performance of the driver can vary. Damon Hill has a Random Grip Range of 1342, which means he each race he can perform between 15980 and 14638. Remember how Lewis Hamilton struggled in Russia and Monaco this season? That meant a huge Random Grip Range for him.
Power (Race and Qualification) - This is the engine horsepower.
Car Failure Probability - The bigger in original game is Larrousse with 8704 and the smaller Ligier with 512. I would say McLaren-Honda 2017 would be 15000.

I don't change anything else (apart from cars, team and drivers names, points, etc., but nothing more that interferes with playability). I once tested Grip Factor and the game got weird. Changed weight and got weird too. I read somewhere that no one knows exactly what is Random Power Variation (?) so the best is leave it as it is.
I just want the game as it is, but harder. (Side note: I once tested the CC cars with 1500 horsepower but it was useless, they don't go higher than 345 km/h. But try to test your car with 1500 horsepower and see how fast you can go in Monza.)


All the rest is related to what we learned by playing original GP2. Everyone who was able to win the championship against Schumacher in the original game was playing with 780 horsepower (what the original game gives you, whichever car you choose) while Schumacher has 750 horsepower and 16384 of grip.
But could you win against Schumacher (16384 grip) while having just the same 750 horsepower? Just play with Jos Verstappen and Selected Team Power on.

Moreover, we can create whatever we want. You can have multiple rivals at the front, all with approximate Grip and chances, or you can go with a car with less 80 or 100 horsepower and see where you can go.

I'll stop and let you pose questions because I might get too long again. Last note: do the Performance > Calculate > grid and race in the original carset and use it as a reference to create a new one. (Or just upload a different carset and run it, there are so many...)

roland ratzenberger
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Re: gp2 difficulty level beyond ace

Post by roland ratzenberger » 27.09.2017, 19:20

hello mate.. thank you for your answer .. you have make me understand a lot of things.. you are right i will try experimenting with the original carset. from what i have understand what i have to change in first place is first of all to select the selected team power and then manipulate the power , the grip and and the random grip range. AM I RIGHT?

roland ratzenberger
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Re: gp2 difficulty level beyond ace

Post by roland ratzenberger » 27.09.2017, 22:38

hello again mate .. i follow your instructions and i have manage to achieve my purpose :D :D :D :D \:D/ \:D/ \:D/ . i have put more teams upfront. i have make stronger the mclaren and the jordans (for the original carset i speak) and i just have a quick race in monza in ace level.. having gerhard berger. the result was trully excelent.. i had a six car battle including me also for the first place with continyoys overtakes.. i got almost clammy. Unfortunately i have lost the battle( finished 4th just been overtaken in the last corner by hakkinen) but this does not matters..

It is almost incredible how this game (gp2) by all this features , add-ons etc that this site provides.. and by little manipulation.. never stops to surprise us and give us new challenges and renew the passion to play... THERE IS NO RACING GAME LIKE GP2 .. IT WILL SURVIVE FOR AGES (( MAYBE CENTURIES )) HAHAHAHAHAH :D :D :D :D

ismael
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Re: gp2 difficulty level beyond ace

Post by ismael » 27.09.2017, 23:30

Cool! Guess you got the main idea :D Just add that you can just leave the Car Failure Probability as it is, and you also can leave the difference in Grip between Qualifying and Race. I read somewhere that the point of giving 10 or 15 extra horsepower in Qualifying was to make a little more real (in the game) the experience of the qualifying lap. In my Career stuff I'm usually putting the same Grip just to simplify the procedure.

Unless in a specific case that I wanted to put a driver more effective in qualifying than in race. I've done this with (now former driver) Daniil Kvyat, giving him more grip in qualifying and less in race. Perhaps in the future I return to that idea, after all the original GP2 applies it. But I think it's not the most important.

Racing with Pacific?
If you try the Pacific, it will happen what I read somewhere (I think in a GP3 forum) and also what happened to me while racing with a fictional Coca-Cola team: you'll get strangely good results. Remember that if you're a GP2 champion, if one could give a grade/note to your driving, equivalent to Grip, should be around 16184. In Pacific you'll have a team-mate with grip 14000 something, so you'll be way faster than him.
Reduce even more the horsepower of the Pacific and put Belmondo (if you're driving Gachot) with 15984 like Damon Hill.

Well, that was just a silly thought. Good luck with whatever you choose!

Oh, and don't forget to try to drive with 1500 horsepower in Monza!

roland ratzenberger
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Re: gp2 difficulty level beyond ace

Post by roland ratzenberger » 27.09.2017, 23:46

ismael wrote:
27.09.2017, 23:30
Cool! Guess you got the main idea :D Just add that you can just leave the Car Failure Probability as it is, and you also can leave the difference in Grip between Qualifying and Race. I read somewhere that the point of giving 10 or 15 extra horsepower in Qualifying was to make a little more real (in the game) the experience of the qualifying lap. In my Career stuff I'm usually putting the same Grip just to simplify the procedure.

Unless in a specific case that I wanted to put a driver more effective in qualifying than in race. I've done this with (now former driver) Daniil Kvyat, giving him more grip in qualifying and less in race. Perhaps in the future I return to that idea, after all the original GP2 applies it. But I think it's not the most important.

Racing with Pacific?
If you try the Pacific, it will happen what I read somewhere (I think in a GP3 forum) and also what happened to me while racing with a fictional Coca-Cola team: you'll get strangely good results. Remember that if you're a GP2 champion, if one could give a grade/note to your driving, equivalent to Grip, should be around 16184. In Pacific you'll have a team-mate with grip 14000 something, so you'll be way faster than him.
Reduce even more the horsepower of the Pacific and put Belmondo (if you're driving Gachot) with 15984 like Damon Hill.

Well, that was just a silly thought. Good luck with whatever you choose!

Oh, and don't forget to try to drive with 1500 horsepower in Monza!

well thah would be a kind of a challenge.. but what if i start in the 1994 thomas kost carset with the driver i have in my username???? roland ratzenberger??? just a kind of tribute haha.. of course i have seen that pacific (as in the real 1994 season ) is the weakest team in the game ,, but i would like to make something like what you mention with the simteks

DaSilva82
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Re: gp2 difficulty level beyond ace

Post by DaSilva82 » 28.09.2017, 08:54

Hello!
Great to see that there are people still holding on to GP2!
I read your question and Ismael is mainly right with his answer.
I will try to give you some more information.
First, the random power variation in the Car Settings section is nothing more than a 5 bhp variation between the GP'S. So if your car has 750 bhp, it wil give you between 745 and 755 bhp during a GP weekend. You can check this if you are using GP2 Lap. So in my opinion: extra realism cause no engine is exactly the same in a whole year!

The grip factor in de Car Settings section is basically the same as the grip factor of the drivers but this one is for the player. The higher the value, the less grip you will have Default is 198. Ismael seem to have problems with it but I change this value every GP year and it always works for me. So I'm curious what those problems are.
Same thing with the car weight. I always adjusted it to keep the simulation as real as possible and it never gave me any trouble.

Of course, all these adjustments will influence the performance on all tracks, if you want to change the performance for each track at a time, you'll have to use rremedio 's slot & tyre editor. You can change the qual and race grip in the magic data wich only will influence the cc.

Using all this, you can make a very difficult and spectacular championship! I always put the numbers in such a way that I always have to drive like hell to get pole position or victory!

I hope I helped you some more with this and if you have questions: bring it on!
Have a good race man! :D

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rremedio
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Re: gp2 difficulty level beyond ace

Post by rremedio » 28.09.2017, 14:46

Hi guys!

Just adding a little bit of info on some values:

Grip Factor: this is a physics value related to the tires. The more you raise it, the lower the grip (in 350, it feels like the end of a long stint in original GP2). It has a very minor effect on the ccs laptimes. I personally like to keep it under 250 because the wheel spin if you raise it too much is not very realistic.

Car weight: despite what GP2Edit says, both values affect the ccs with the ccs car weight affecting them much more. If you are driving with engine powers somewhat similar to original GP2 (700-800bhp), you can set both values the same with good results. If you are using lower powered cars (like F1 from the 70ies, or touring cars), you want to set the cc car weight lower than the human car weight (the lower the power, the bigger the difference) to avoid being so much faster than them in the race start or when exiting low speed corners.

If you are so fast that the maximum grip values available in GP2Edit are not enough for you to have a challenge, there is the Overall CC Grip Level in the Misc tab of the Slot and Tyres Editor 4. It will make the ccs faster in all slots.

There is also the Human Grip factor in the same tab. Default is 16384. Let's say you have the same pace as a 16384 cc, lowering it to 15500 will give you a pace similar to a 15500 cc. But it will also affect the ccs in a minor way, so it is not perfect.

About failure rates, I can't find the original topic but I have a quote of TDK's original post on how it works:
TdK wrote:First off all:
The maximum for reliability is 16384. You can find out why in the orginal carset. There all the
values are made from 16384.

For an example:
Benetton/williams: 2048 = 4 times a failure = 512 for 1 failure
McLaren = 6656 / 512 = 13

32 x 512 = 16384
Every failure a car has is 1. when a race starts you have 2 cars in a team. So, there are 16 races:
16 x 2 = 32
32 x 512 = 16384 --> the max. value. Which means 100% unreliable...
So; In one season of 16 races, a team (2 cars each race, which makes 2x16 races=32) suffers 10 failures. Then you will get a failure rate off: 16384/32=512 x 10 failures = 5120

Now: When a car is set to 2048, it will suffer failure around 4 times in a season. So this can be 3 times, but also 5 times.
When a value is set at 16384, the max. failures in a season is 32. But they never do this!!! Mostly about 25 times...

Values set above 16384, won't have the same effect. I've tested it some years ago. Settings higher than 16384 will give strange results. Some cars won't have more than 10 failure's, and cars set (just) under 16384 will failure a lot more. Let's say about 25 times...

So as a summary:
The game is not made for failure ranges above 16384. It's not designed for it. Sure, you can try it out, but it will give strange effects.


Try to set a drivers random grip to the max.: 32767. The car will be fast around corners like hell!!! :wink:
What it's not supposed to do! It's high random grip should slow the driver down.... :-k
My personal approach for setting the game's difficulty is to decide where I want to be in the field and go from there. Let's say I'm gonna drive a 750bhp car with a 15500 opponent and I want him to be as fast as me so I have a hard time beating him. I change the carset so all drivers have 15500 grip, 0 grip range and 750bhp power, then I run qualifyings in accelerated time mode, adjusting the Overall CC Grip Level until the best times are 0.1-0.2s faster than me. When I get it, I load the carset with the actual values and race. My pace will be similar to that 15500 guy and the other drivers will be faster or slower according to their grip values in the carset. Of course it won't be perfect since I'm faster on some tracks and slower on others, but it will be generally give me nice results. I just don't choose the tracks where I'm fastest or slowest to run those tests.

There is also the rear wing settings problem. If you drive with rear wing 1, you will have much higher top speed than the ccs in most tracks, you would need to adjust the cc setup in the Track Editor so they match your speed. Another (simpler) solution is to always use enough rear wing (and 6th gear) so you match the speed of ccs with the same car power as you.
"The Fox provides for himself. but God provides for the Lion" - The Marriage of Heaven and Hell by William Blake

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roland ratzenberger
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Re: gp2 difficulty level beyond ace

Post by roland ratzenberger » 28.09.2017, 22:33

hello guys, i have used the slot editor by remedio to improve some problems i had with 2 circuits in my current 2017 gp2 edition. the problems were with singapoore where was too easy to win , and with abu dhabi where was imposiible to win. thanks to this tool i have manage to fix the problem and the now the performance is as usual as in the other tracks.. BUT to be honest i do not want to manipulate at least at this point any other carset and edition except from the original one. as i said before i had a great race with 6 cars battling constantly for the first place.. total incredible... the truth is that as far as the diificulty level is concerned , that there is no limit up to how difficult you can make the game.. sky is the limit.. there are so many things to change and i want to try that.. up to now my purpose ( to find if you can make the game more difficult than usual) has been achieved, and i hope many others by this topic to discover the oustanding abilities of this game :D :D :D

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